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agenda.cstx.gov/2010/030210%20--%20City%20Council%20Special%20Meeting.pdfLooks like CS employees who report directly to the council received evaluations yesterday evening. I wonder if the manager and attorney will receive raises for the way they pushed the desire of the council with respect to the red-light camera issues last fall? Last March, they all received retroactive (to Jan 1) 4% raises, and in 2008 they received 5% raises. www.theeagle.com/local/CS-city-employees-given-a-4--increase-Hopefully Hooks didn't get penalized for not updating the list of council members/mayor pro tem on the agenda header... [This message has been edited by twiggy (edited 3/3/2010 9:01a).]
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Of course they can give raises, all they have to do is increase the utility rates to cover them!
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Oh. Can I please, please, please evaluate David Gwin.....please?
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No kidding Allonym. They'll just keep stealing from CSU.
Should anyone in City Hall get raises while the city is cutting back overall?
Let me ask a better question: Should anyone in City Hall get a raise before we raise the salaries of our woefully underpaid police and fire personnel?
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Did anyone ever come across the salary schedule for our current police & fire departments? Just curious....
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FYI: No pay increases for any of the five appointed folks, just as there are no pay increases this year for any other city employee.
-jgs
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Jay, thanks for confirming that for us. What a relief!!
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quote:
woefully underpaid police and fire personnel
? compared to similar positions in what cities the size of College Station? Do you have a link to this data? I would be interested in seeing it. I'm not saying that they are overpaid (nor do I agree that they are "woefully underpaid" - I am just wondering what data this statement is based on?
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Thanks sum. Some of the comments made are down right comical.
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SumAggie-I found police to police in Bryan and College Station as the closest (apples to apples) on pay between similar size cities. Looks pretty close to me. Hope this was what you were looking for.
http://www.cstx.gov/index.aspx?page=2200
http://www.bryantx.gov/departments/?name=police_os_sup#train
Look under the pictures for a tab marked salaries and click to get a PDF
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Looking at the proposed city budget for 2010 on the COCS website: Police Dept. page 39 shows total salaries $11,996,910 for 177.5 people. Average ='s out to $67,588. Fire Dept. page 52 shows total salaries $9,195,433 for 122 people. Average ='s out to $75,372.
Now I understand not everyone earns the AVERAGE amount, but seems like the big guys are really taking in the bucks or the average person is not that destitute!
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Here's Arlington
At one year, $51,987 CS $42,034 Bryan, $44,637 At 30 months (six months Academy, 2 years service) Arlington $57,315 Bryan $45,802 CS $44,594 [This message has been edited by aggieknit (edited 3/4/2010 4:30p).]
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Arlington? You're comparing apples to oranges. Lets see Wellborn start a PD and pay what Arlington pays, how about that? Oh wait, I better stay away from anything that could impose new taxes...
[This message has been edited by bigloco1 (edited 3/4/2010 7:38p).]
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I can't seem to find the budget you're referring to, but I did find this. I know it's a year old, but you can imagine that there's not THAT much difference between last year and this year, especially considering the fact that the city reported a $1.5M shortfall. quote:
the big guys are really taking in the bucks or the average person is not that destitute!
Make your own decision based on this: http://s755.photobucket.com/albums/xx192/brj1991/?action=view¤t=001.jpgThe "average" doesn't even get close to the MAXIMUM salary for anyone until you get to the Fire Marshall & Assistant Chief. The "skill levels" shown are based on taking certain classes that are pertinent to your job function. The FD has been informed that due to the current budget crunch, no additional skills pay will be approved until further notice, meaning everyone is stuck right where they are until the CoCS finally makes some good financial decisions. I too will be curious if the council again votes themselves a raise again when the line-level workers have been told "just be happy you have a job". edit: fix the link [This message has been edited by brj1991 (edited 3/4/2010 7:32p).] [This message has been edited by brj1991 (edited 3/4/2010 7:33p).]
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quote:
I too will be curious if the council again votes themselves a raise again when the line-level workers have been told "just be happy you have a job".
The council members have no salary.
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Pie in the Sky - Just to clarify: those figures you are quoting are not just salary - they are total personnel cost. Including things like retirement contributions, insurances, social security(if the city participates in SS) & medicare costs that the City pays.
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Sorry... that should have been "I too will be curious if the council votes them [City Hall: manager, secretary, attorney, etc] a raise when the line-level workers have been told "just be happy you have a job".
I think I shouldn't drink and type....
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Pie in the Sky et al, I have a page on this on my website actually: http://www.jessfields.com/police-and-fire-salariesReasonable people can disagree, I think, about whether or not police/fire should be paid significantly more. My position is that they should, but hey, that's just my position. At the least, I hope you understand why I take that position. Our officers are the lowest-paid in the county. And on the personnel salaries, that is including the 50+ civilian workers whose salaries are not so widely published (at least, I don't think). I'm not sure how that distorts the figure, which is available on the CSPD website and the fire salaries similarly. Both are linked on my page above. The general point about our police and fire departments is that they need better resources, particularly the police. The police have the city sectioned up into "beats" which are overseen by a police sergeant who oversees the activity of patrol officers in that area and get to know their neighborhoods and the needs thereof. Well, the city currently has one beat for the ENTIRE eastside of College Station, from Raintree all the way down to Pebble Creek. Of course, crime there is not as bad as in other parts of the city... But when you consider (and this is an opinion I heard from high up in CSPD) that new development and new growth is going to be coming in on the south side (Lowe's, HEB), you're going to need more resources to maintain a high level of security for citizens and their property. College Station is used to being a fairly safe city, and I would think most people would want to keep it that way. One big part of that is decreasing the turnover rate among officers to have more a more experienced force in the long run, which would be directly helped with a significant pay raise across the board for officers and particularly for patrol officers. Another part is actually hiring more officers to be able to maintain more beats, including the provision of a new beat for the south/southeast part of the city. A big final improvement would be more facilities for our police department. Instead of the taj mahal city hall, perhaps we could benefit most by building a sub-station for CSPD somewhere in the southern part of the city. It wouldn't have to cost 20-or-30 someodd million, and goodness... Talk about planning for the future! This would give our city a huge head start in planning for future growth in population and the resultant increase in crime frequency. My general point is that we should focus on what really matters in College Station. From that logic, the police deserve better attention on what they need, in terms of personnel resources and otherwise. Jess. [This message has been edited by TexasCigars (edited 3/5/2010 3:20a).]
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Jess I agree completely! The city needs to GET BACK TO FUNDAMENTALS!
Trying to come up with mult-million dollar projects to spend tax payer moneys all the while denying legitimate developments costing us millions in lawsuits and legal fees is not what the council is for or should be doing.
They need to serve the public trust by providing the services for which they were created to oversee. Not build legacy's to their greatness!
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Could the fire stations serve as a sub-station for PD?
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I stopped by the one on Wm D Fitch the other day when my dog got out to see if they had seen him. That one has a "police office" in the front of it, though I can't ever remember seeing police cars parked there when I have driven by.
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From what I understand, the PD has no specific "sub-stations." I'm not sure if they use the fire stations for anything, but that's actually not a bad idea in the interim, Pie.
Allonym, I agree that it's pretty simple: instead of going into debt due to pet projects, perhaps we should do things (like build a police substation) which actually prepare us for the future.
Imagine how far ahead of the game our PD would be if we raised pay and decreased turnover, built a substation, and drew another beat in the southern part of the city.
And we could do all of that for much less than the proposed $20 million greenways project.
[This message has been edited by TexasCigars (edited 3/5/2010 2:00p).]
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Just curious about raises in previous years for council-appointed vs. other employees. Are the raises for city manager, city attorney, etc. in line with what other employees received?
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Bigloco,
Arlington is about twice the size of Bryan and College Station. It is actually similar in many ways, including having colleges and lots of visitors.
Let's look at Sugar Land, pop. 84,500 (so smaller than BCS) where a certified office can make $47,694 to start. So, it's easy to stay in CS a year or so and get certified, let them pay all the training costs (which does include salary while you are in academy) and then you can move on. Hiring certified officers can save a city a lot of money because they don't have to pay for academy and salary for months and not have any idea what they will get.
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brj1991...where did you find your info? Do you have the same for PD? I was able to speak with a firefighter and he verifed what you have. His comments to me were these are base salaries, and certifications are additional up to $3600 annually. It also takes approx. 3-4 years of service to obtain the listed skill levels by rank as you show. Then they are on performance base. He stated PD was very similar. He pointed out that most firefighters are able to work another job outside of the department because they are 24 hours on duty and 48 hours off. Although he did say they work 2912 hours annually compared to police at 2080. Also the city will be hiring 36 firefighters for the new station 6 that is being built.
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I don't have it for the police. Finding that paper was actually a fluke. I found it sitting on a desk at kinko's next to a fax machine about 6 months ago when I went in to fax something. It caught my eye and I saved it because my cousin wants to be a fireman and had asked me if I knew what the local fire departments make.
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PD sub-stations were planned and built at Fire Stations 3 and 5 as well as in the Northgate parking garage. CSPD does not use them.
I think they want their own Taj-ma PD.
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Or perhaps.... they were planned by people not on the PD, the PD input was not gotten and they are possibly inadequate to the task 
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Allonym,
I think there could possibly be truth to what you say. Overall, it seems that the PD is not getting the resources that it feels it needs. There is a balance, of course, and you can't simply throw money at the problem.
However, one "resource" the PD could certainly use would be better communication from City Hall, whether it be on budgetary matters or anything.
That's a simple improvement that could go a long way to resolve some of these issues, at a low cost (or no cost). The city just has to take an interest in police issues.
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A little analysis of the 2008-2009-2010 budget WRT police and fire salaries. All are averages of salaries among approved number of positions.
Patrol Officer: +4.64% in 2009, +14.9% in 2010
Asst Police Chief: +4.00% in 2009, +1.02% in 2010
Chief of Police: +5.42% in 2009, +4.87% in 2010
Firefighter: +5.75% in 2009, +2.02% in 2010
Asst Fire Chief: +5.00% in 2009, +4.99% in 2010
Fire Chief: +11.30% in 2009, +4.31% in 2010
Looks like they’re making a legitimate effort
to increase patrol officer salaries in the next budget year.
Someone else mentioned that with annexation comes an increased burden on police and fire services as a whole, which, I would think, would mean an increase in workload for the firemen out there on shift, right. Why do the fire chiefs get double or more the percentage raise that the shift personnel get? I would think that if anyone should get more, it would be the men and women on the streets putting their lives on the line.... or maybe I am way off...
Source:
http://www.cstx.gov/Modules/ShowDocument.aspx?documentid=6620
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